00:00:06

James Redenbaugh: Good afternoon. Looks like Frank is ready to. To take off in the convertible.

00:00:16

Andreas Fauler: Yeah. Nice. You are mute, Frank. Mute.

00:00:30

Frank Kuhnecke: I mute.

00:00:33

Andreas Fauler: Now we can hear you. Yeah.

00:00:44

Will Dragon: We can hear you, Frank.

00:00:45

Andreas Fauler: Now we can.

00:00:46

James Redenbaugh: Okay, great.

00:00:47

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, it's working.

00:00:50

Frank Kuhnecke: I have to do it via iPhone because I was too long at the customer.

00:00:59

Will Dragon: This. That's not a bad thing.

00:01:02

Frank Kuhnecke: No, not really. Sunny. I'm sitting in the cabriolet. Life is easy.

00:01:08

Will Dragon: Yeah. And the shirt.

00:01:17

James Redenbaugh: How is everybody today?

00:01:21

Andreas Fauler: Great.

00:01:25

Will Dragon: How are you, James?

00:01:27

James Redenbaugh: Good. Just getting up at a engagement show yesterday and at the ocean. I never drive to the beach. It's only like an hour and a half away. And we drove yesterday, like. Oh, yeah, we're. We're pretty close to the ocean. Why don't we do this more often? Yeah.

00:01:53

Will Dragon: Nice work.

00:01:54

Andreas Fauler: Too much?

00:01:56

James Redenbaugh: I do no fun.

00:01:58

Andreas Fauler: No. Oh, only hard work.

00:02:03

James Redenbaugh: I moved back to the east coast and now I just work all the time because there's no mountains to climb.

00:02:12

Andreas Fauler: Easy decision to work easy.

00:02:15

James Redenbaugh: Yeah. But plotting my return to the west coast sometime soon.

00:02:22

Will Dragon: Nice.

00:02:23

Andreas Fauler: Okay.

00:02:24

Will Dragon: Is that where the heart is?

00:02:27

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, I think so. In the west coast or like Portugal? West coast of Europe? Some west coast somewhere.

00:02:38

Will Dragon: Somewhere on the west. Yeah.

00:02:40

James Redenbaugh: Yeah.

00:02:42

Andreas Fauler: Are you surfing or what? Why? Do you like both or just.

00:02:48

James Redenbaugh: I more. I. I more just love the beauty in the mountains and the ocean. I surf sometimes, but I. I snowboard and ski in the winter and I rock climb and mountain bike.

00:03:00

Andreas Fauler: Yeah. Okay. I know some people from the US who are like, who like to surf and they also love photographers.

00:03:09

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, it's got great surfing there, but.

00:03:11

Andreas Fauler: It'S also having a great tech community in the meantime. It's really.

00:03:15

James Redenbaugh: Yeah. Yeah. And cheaper energy than Germany. Great. So we can hop right in if we want. Have you guys had a chance to check out what I shared in Figma? Will I see you in there?

00:03:49

Will Dragon: Yeah, I've just, I've literally just jumped on it in the last half an hour and it's great. I think it's. It's perfect for what I need.

00:03:58

Andreas Fauler: You.

00:03:59

Will Dragon: Know, as long as obviously Frank andreas are kind of happy with the kind of framework of it. I mean, it's perfect for kind of just kind of starting to visualize some bits and pieces. So appreciate you doing that.

00:04:09

James Redenbaugh: Great. Yeah, it's really. It's designed to be a starting place to start the conversation. We can, we can take it in a different direction at this point if needed. But yeah. Frank andres, how does. What's your impression seeing this?

00:04:28

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, I mean, I see A lot of things we already discussed from the content side and the wording and so on. So like you have already quite a lot of things that have been discussed in and of course now we can work on. On feedback and details. So from the structure and everything I like it. I think yeah, I mean design will evolve but I think we are generally in a quite clean approach and then see how. What craziness we will develop. But I. I think similar then as we started with Will. So I would say from that general approach I also think it's a. It's. It's good but of course it probably will evolve with the type, with the fonts and so on. But yeah, first we like it didn't have a look into every detail of the text but of course I mean now we can work on it and.

00:05:23

James Redenbaugh: Yeah it definitely lacks anything bold yet and I think that we can definitely make some bigger bolder not too crazy but definitely something that sets it apart.

00:05:39

Andreas Fauler: Yeah content and design wise and catches attention and really sucks people in let's say and Frank and myself we had a brief session I think yesterday and we discussed a little bit on yeah a little bit what's our different. What is a very. Probably the shortest way of explaining it. And then if you have the let's say skeleton you can evolve it into different directions and details. So we have made some progress here and so there have been also some insight for us I think so I think this is something we also can share. We a little bit worked based on the category design methodology but it's not rocket science. But starting with a problem, coming up with potential outcomes and then having a point of view that is insightful and yeah makes pink people think oh this sounds interesting. Should have a deeper look. Yeah so great.

00:06:42

James Redenbaugh: Is that in the form of a document you want to share that.

00:06:47

Andreas Fauler: I have in. In the designing sales Kung Fu Google Slides doc I have some updates but Frank also has more detailed version but probably he cannot share it right now. But I will share.

00:07:03

Frank Kuhnecke: I cannot share it right now. I will do it afterward because I have to go back to the office for this and this was planned but it didn't happen.

00:07:17

Andreas Fauler: Here is a Google Doc. This is the first version with some also probably I can share it if you like I can share briefly one or two things in a session and then you get a first glimpse because it's a little bit more concrete and also nice down. So I think one of the interesting or bold decisions we made was to nice down a little bit and not be Too broad. Yeah.

00:07:46

Frank Kuhnecke: If you like, you can share version three.

00:07:50

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, okay. Yeah, okay. Okay. Then I will do it though. Yeah, right.

00:07:56

Frank Kuhnecke: Because still in German, but translation is not a problem.

00:08:01

Andreas Fauler: One moment, I need to find it. One moment, one moment. Here we go. Yeah, okay, I've got it. And now I'm sharing. Okay, so share. Okay, so the headliner, but probably so Zi Hing is a master in Kung Fu. And probably we are that courageous to say to call it the seeing path or the seeing Journey. Let's see what's better in English. In German, fat makes sense. So really bringing in this word that is probably not known to many, but you can explain it and make some, let's say feeling. And then the general headline is something like Sales Kung Fu and the how of the best challenger sellers. And Challenger sales is really, I would say the best high level or high quality sales methodology to sell innovative technologies that require organizations to change. So typically it's innovative technology that has a big organizational impact. Hopefully of course to the better. But this kind of stuff is complex. You have. You need to not only put position the product, but also things beyond product. So we know most of the potential clients we want to work with are probably using challenger sales. And there's also research that challenger sellers are in this context much more successful. But there's also research that only a few sellers can adopt it. And that's for the reason that challenger sales tells you what you need to do in the sales cycle, but not how. And we would be the how of challenger sales. So if you're sitting in front of a customer, how do you get to the point you want to be with challenger sales? And so, and we have seen on different levels we can very well align with challenger wording and elements. For example, there's an emotional path and so on. So it has a very good connection to our dimensions. Let's say though this is the first thing and with a picture here you see literally so here sales methodology. But we would now say challenger sales. So typically, yeah, you can get to a decent level of performance if you know the technology or the sales methodology. And if you're very, if you have a very good work ethic, you can have some slightly upside. But at the end, the bigger impact once you peaked on the methodology side is to improve your skills. And on the right side you see a typical performance distribution in sales. And it's more Parisian than Gaussian. That means most of the people are on the bottom and very few are really good. And there's really a name called star sellers or star performers. And this is really a few. So below 1%, it's very rare. And then there's a differentiation between a top performer and I would say the most top performers are occasional top performers. So they make it every two or three years. But then a very small part of sellers is able to consistently outperform. And our insight here is to say you need to be able to connect to very different kinds of customers and personalities on the customer side. And you need to be good in each part of the sales cycle. And if you can do both, you can be successful with a very different kind of customers. While if you are just capable to do one or two things good, then you need to find the right customer that fits to your profile. So as you know we have the sales kung fu assessment and there typical finding that we see is everybody has strengths in one or two skills and probably some weaknesses. And one of the first, let's say things you can achieve is first of all know what you do very often and very good. Probably be careful not to over do it. And the other thing is to work on the skills that are underrepresented. And if you do it, you out of a sudden unlock potential in terms of. Yeah. With whom you can work well and in which cases, situations you are very good. So this is therefore I. This picture is quite rich on the, on the how we create value or what the assumptions are, how to create value. And the other thing, yeah, we said as we know, most sales organizations don't want to have a new methodology and say hey, trainings, we did a lot, but it has no big impact. People are doing the same as before. Therefore we want to show very proactively it's not a methodology, it's not a traditional training, it's a skill set. There is an assessment. You get individual, let's say areas where you can work on. And during the six months pass, you not only work on your specific weaknesses and strengths, you also work on two customer situations that you can substantially progress over the time and you will also have a very immediate impact based on that. So it's a mixture of let's say content training and let's say coaching. So this is literally also the aspect and one of the key things is of course you need to practice a lot because you want it to become part of your intuition, part of your unconscious intelligence. And therefore the fight club is in third element. And this is something on that level. I think it makes sense to make it clear. And also show a little bit of how we do it differently. Yeah. And then we have some KPIs probably we need to find out which ones we highlight most. But a lot of things that go very well into what we can help support. And here are more details. I think that's a key. Or Frank. Yeah. High level at least. Yeah. And then we need to see how far. I think we need to have probably different levels of detail about the story. And of course we also want to talk about which gates we have and the different skills, but probably not on the website on the first page at least. So let's see how far. How far into the details we go. But this would be the high level story.

00:15:56

James Redenbaugh: Great.

00:15:58

Andreas Fauler: And we will translate this document and provide it to you after this session. So you have it.

00:16:05

James Redenbaugh: Awesome. Yeah, sounds like that will be very helpful. A small point. I'm curious what you mean by Parisian and Gaussian when you were referring to the diagram.

00:16:27

Andreas Fauler: Okay. Gaussian is a normal distribution or the bell curve, which is the average is dominant. And on the both extremes you have similar distribution. And Parisian would be power distribution. Literally. And it's a little bit of a mix, but it's. It's heavier on the lower side. So there are less top performers than below average performers. So 30% of salespeople make quota typically. And very few are much over it. So. And there are some who have 7x the performance of the average one. So there are some people who shoot it through the roof and these are the star performers. And yeah.

00:17:22

James Redenbaugh: Yeah.

00:17:23

Frank Kuhnecke: We shouldn't use statistical terms because statistical knowledge and sales is not so broad.

00:17:30

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, right. Yeah. Okay. That's. I mean these super cool guys, they know it. Of course. Yeah. Okay, you're right. Don't. But you are into statistics, James. I see it.

00:17:45

Will Dragon: I'm just googling it now. So.

00:17:50

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, for example. Yeah. And I mean the origin story of the methodology is you model the best performers versus the normal ones and see what do they do different. This was the origin story when Frank invited invented the story, the methodology. So it started exactly the way what do the best do different than the average ones. And we are not talking about the losers. We are only average to it best. And it's. You can bring it down to some quite understandable atomic things. And that's also something you can understand it and you can learn it in many areas or many sales people think, oh, this is a part of you can do it or you can't do it. It's like an art but you cannot learn it. Yeah. And so it's understandable. It's learnable.

00:18:51

James Redenbaugh: Right. So I think that there is a lot in here already that is describing what you guys are offering and how it's different. And there's definitely some more that can be added and can be. Can emerge around that. And now I'm also, in listening to you speak, wondering if, like, we've talked about a bit, there might be a moment that we want to create some kind of small demonstration of what it. What it looks like in some way without revealing too much or getting too much into specifics or something like that. But if there's a moment maybe here or down here, to. To kind of illustrate clearly what some of these movements might look like, practically speaking. So, you know, the start of a sales conversation into the first move, into the next move, and then it. It closes. And, you know, these could be represented by different colors or maybe we see a gradient in the background changing from one thing to a next. You know what I mean? Is that something that we still want to represent here? What. How are we feeling about this?

00:21:21

Andreas Fauler: I think it makes sense. One version would be to have a video, to be honest, because then you have more. But I like the idea to really do it like a abstract, like a conversation, but probably with graphics. Haven't thought about this way or to represent it, but could work, I think, and would be probably also insightful. What do you think, Frank?

00:21:49

Frank Kuhnecke: I didn't get it really, till now. Sorry. Do you want to create a flowchart of a sales conversation?

00:22:00

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, basically.

00:22:03

Frank Kuhnecke: Okay, got. I got it.

00:22:07

James Redenbaugh: Yeah.

00:22:07

Frank Kuhnecke: We have. We have several steps. We can divide the communication in steps and we can create. Define typical situations for this. This we can do.

00:22:28

James Redenbaugh: Andreas, tell me what you're thinking about with the.

00:22:34

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, I mean, video is, of course, richer, but it's more difficult to explain what's exactly happening. Therefore, you have a different challenge, I would say. And I mean, were once thinking, okay, we take snippets from films, but the films, they. They do not have the richness that you can show a lot. So sometimes it's only one or two things. So even if you think it's a great conversation sometimes, okay, it's. It's quite basic, but so there. We haven't been too successful. Of course we could record something, but, yeah, I mean, with the flowchart, you can demonstrate one aspect to the point and show some insight. Very easy. So if it works, I would say probably it's easier to understand what's happening.

00:23:24

Frank Kuhnecke: We can define critical situations where you have to act properly. And the problem now is we have to do it in two languages. So the only actors are Andreas and me. But we can say this is a typical situation where you have to challenge a customer how to do it and how it goes wrong. This we can do.

00:23:54

Andreas Fauler: So we can take this task and prepare something and then let's see where it leads us. I would say, or one or two or three version or different situations.

00:24:07

James Redenbaugh: Great.

00:24:07

Andreas Fauler: And I mean, the idea with the colors, I think is also good because of course, you probably remember the different areas where you can be in the conversation and showing. Okay, now it's heating up. You need to be more on the green now or you start. Typically you should start green before you push them too hard. So this kind of things can be easily.

00:24:34

Will Dragon: Just on. Just on your note, though, Andreas, about video. I mean, video is a great way to get a lot of information across in a very short period of time. Because I think it's often quite difficult to kind of demonstrate a process. So there are kind of very graphic. And so using simple graphics and typography, there are ways that you can show how a process might work quite effectively. And you can always subtitle it or you can voiceover it so you can do it across both languages. So, again, something that is worth considering maybe a little bit further down the line. My next point as well is just what is the next stage after the website? So we keep talking about more detail and when we're going to start picking up more detail. For me, it's just worth bearing in mind what that then looks like. Is that going to be a series of. Again, just following on from the sales journey for. For sales, Kung Fu is like what happens if someone contacts you and then shows interest? What is the next level of information that you give to them? Is that going to be in the form of a document PowerPoint PDF? Is it going to be another website or something that they would then, you know, is it something that we would like tag onto the back of this so that you capture their data and then they could potentially log in to find out more around what the actual core of the course might look like. What does six months look like? What does. You know? So it's just kind of understanding that what we always said that this first website was going to be very top level, which I think is perfect. And I think what James has done is brilliant. It's exactly the kind of information that people are going to need to start to kind of pique their interest. But then from this, where do we then go? What does it then look like? So it's worth understanding what that next stage is. And then obviously you've then got the training material and the actual course itself. Again, what format does that take? What, what information and how is that broken down? I know that we've got the various kind of platforms and the gates and those types of things. So it's kind of, I think what might now be useful is kind of getting a breakdown of information and kind of top level, middle and then deep content and how that starts to look. Because obviously once we've got the website up and running and we get ready to kind of start pushing it out there, it's going to very quickly come around to, you know, next steps and ages. Building all of that out and having all of that prepared, all of that side of things is again going to be something that, and again just looking at the documents that you shared and the language that you and Frank use, it's, it's about getting all of that information down and then for me it's also about having that looked at from a copy point of views to make sure that everything is in depth enough, but also easily for people to digest and understand so that it's not over complicated or not. You know, so all of those types of things, we now need to start to kind of get working on the back of everything that we're doing at this front end as well.

00:28:18

Frank Kuhnecke: Yeah. So if I understand you, probably we should create a tree diagram or flowchart of the informations we want to share, from overview to more detail to specific. I think it has to be our job, of course, and you can decide what is useful, what we take next and so on.

00:28:48

Will Dragon: Yeah, I think, I mean, I don't know. James, what do you think around the kind of copywriting point of view for the course itself? Because, Because I think a lot of it is obviously the devil's in the detail and obviously the learning is the core thing here, but also it needs to be done in a way that makes it digestible and straightforward enough for people to kind of understand easily but have enough detail in it so that obviously it gives those key insights that we're pushing. And, and I think.

00:29:26

Andreas Fauler: Absolutely.

00:29:27

Will Dragon: I think a lot of the time what we discussed, Andreas and Frank, is also that you guys are obviously very close to what the course is and, and your understanding of it and your understanding is extremely broad and well perceived. But people looking at it from the outside coming into it. You need to kind of take them on a journey so that. Yeah, that. I mean hands and then you at each point so that they get that full understanding.

00:29:59

Andreas Fauler: I would say for the individual journey, I would say we probably be. They need to quite early apply to participate in the program. So I would say this is more standardized process and the idea here is to say, hey, if you want to get more details, apply for the program, then there is a questionnaire. They have to give us some information and then we select the right persons and then probably they get a proposal and then they can sign up to it or not. So pretty straightforward. But you're right, there will be probably one more detailed information we push after they have applied or some kind of thing. And for the enterprise clients there are different building blocks, but there would be some kind of discovery where we also gather information from them and based on that they get a proposal which is more individualized.

00:31:00

Frank Kuhnecke: But the problem already is we have to structurize our informations. And I would recommend that Andreas and I will create a mind map of the information on different levels of depth and then we can discuss what is good for the first concrete level for the second. And for the deep dive this year you only get till now parts of it and we are discussing a little bit back. So this is our job to do and I think we can do it till in this week.

00:31:44

Andreas Fauler: Okay, Makes sense. Yeah.

00:31:47

James Redenbaugh: Cool.

00:31:47

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, exactly.

00:31:48

James Redenbaugh: Yeah.

00:31:49

Andreas Fauler: There are some artifacts we probably need in different contexts and this is probably exactly what you were referring to. Which kind of artifacts should be created.

00:31:59

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, yeah.

00:32:00

Frank Kuhnecke: And we can sign a black box for here. We can make a video with this content until it's not ready. But that you have the overview.

00:32:13

James Redenbaugh: Yeah. Well, I think it's wonderful to be thinking about what the. What the learning needs to look like, what the next phase is, how these things can get delivered. Because that should inform how it's. How it's presented now. Yeah, yeah. And I imagine that all these things will evolve in. In parallel. And once the, the learning and the delivery is really clear, then the sales materials can be updated as well to show that off. And Frank, I think it's exactly the right thing to think about. What's the high level, the deeper and the deepest. And this initial sales page, we want to communicate that the depth is there and not expect anyone to. To grok the depth right away. Or maybe they grock it, but they don't deeply understand it. But that the surface stuff we can, they should be able to get right away if it's right for them.

00:33:51

Andreas Fauler: You shouldn't answer every question with the website because people need to reach out to us.

00:33:55

Will Dragon: Yeah, yeah.

00:33:57

Andreas Fauler: About. Oh, what is it exactly?

00:34:00

Will Dragon: Yeah, I think. And I think what James has done does that perfectly. So, you know, obviously there's room for tweaking bits and pieces. But this level of information I think is perfect to get people interested. But then it's. Then how do we then deliver that question? How do we answer that next question? You know, what form does it take? You know, is it. Is it a website? You know, it's just kind of understanding, you know, that the product journey for sales Kung Fu, you know, what it looks like and how you start to then deliver those bits of information and the course itself, etc. Etc. So.

00:34:39

Frank Kuhnecke: Yeah, yeah, this is part of the mind map we have to do.

00:34:45

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, great.

00:34:48

Andreas Fauler: Cool.

00:34:51

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, so that'll be part of the homework also. Right now, obviously it's just a home page and I'm wondering what other pages we should be considering at this time. I think obviously the home pages is most important and maybe we don't need them. But in your minds, what other pages are there?

00:35:25

Andreas Fauler: One moment. I think probably we have one page for each of the Personas. One for the individual seller, one for the. For the sales leader. If we have another level of detail or probably we say we need. This is enough. But probably it's cool to say, hey, if you're an individual seller, have a look here. And then we have something special because it will be a slightly different positioning how we position it. And then probably we will have one side where we go into a little bit of detail of what is sales Kung Fu, I don't know. And then also about us. So at the end, who is behind says Kung Fu? I mean, we have the idea to create advisory board. Until now it's only two people, but at least the two of us should be somehow presented and potentially advisory board, but probably not in the first version, but a little bit who is behind it. Yeah, that's.

00:36:37

Frank Kuhnecke: I think three pages more is enough for the beginning, the individual path, the organizational path and who we are. Because the people want to have biography. Because our biography is. Is worthy and powerful. We should use it and everything else. A page for scientific background. And so comes later.

00:37:06

James Redenbaugh: Great.

00:37:12

Frank Kuhnecke: Usual part of the Mind Map 2, we will create an overview of the pages with our ideas and you can. You have to decide what is useful and what is too much because our art of reduction is not very developed.

00:37:38

James Redenbaugh: Wonderful. Yeah, more. More is good. At the beginning we can always take away. And here in Figma I'm demonstrating the comment functionality. I think when you are looking at this you won't see all these tools but you should have a comment button like this and you can comment on anything and say I like this or here's how I would say this or this is great as it is. So that will be very helpful. And as part of the homework today or this week, I'll also share, maybe I'll frame everything into a single Google Doc so we can keep things in one place and we can drop things in there as needed. And I'll create a high level outline not in this format where I've really visualized everything, but just in the Google Doc with my sense of what sections are needed for each of those pages. So you can start to punch stuff in and of course you can add sections as needed or take them away. So hopefully that'll be really clear. I can share that later today after the call. But while we're here, is there anything. Should we. So overall we like the flow in the journey of the home page. And then if were to go into the individual journey, let's say for individuals, what. What are the key parts of that page that we're going to want touch into?

00:40:09

Andreas Fauler: It will be an explanation about the program high level as I just mentioned. So what it's what's the difference? The seeing journey. What is the difference then? Probably a little bit of an outline what happens over the six months. So probably one theme for each month or something like this. So a little bit of a flow. I think this is the main thing or the problems. Which problem statement? So what problem do we solve? And then this was I just sent.

00:40:48

James Redenbaugh: Mention.

00:40:51

Andreas Fauler: The problem point of view explanation, some flow or some six months outline.

00:41:01

James Redenbaugh: Oh and then what does the application look like?

00:41:11

Andreas Fauler: They have to answer some questions. We have some things we expect from them. So for example I would ask them a little bit about their experience, their sales experience. We need to find out which exact questions we ask. Probably also ask them about performance and what we want to find out is if they are. If they're having a growth mindset or not and so probably some questions about this. And we also want to say it's only for you if you want to work on the topic in a quite hard way and do daily work and so on. So we want to also show them it's not for fun. This is literally hard work and you have to commit to it before you apply or within application. So they have to check it or something like this. So we have some things we want to exactly say if you don't want to train every week, don't apply. Literally that bit. Also small provocation, but I think it will attract exactly the right people to make it simple.

00:42:21

Frank Kuhnecke: Three questions. Do you have at least a little bit experience? You're not totally newbie. Are you willing to train it? And do you have concrete cases you can experiment with? Do we have the possibility for concrete experience? Just that we don't have people in the cause who wants to be a sales agent.

00:42:54

James Redenbaugh: Yeah. So it's not just hypothetical, it's a dojo.

00:43:04

Frank Kuhnecke: But we will write it down. We will write it down. The question.

00:43:07

Andreas Fauler: Yeah, yeah.

00:43:09

James Redenbaugh: Just leaving some notes in there.

00:43:15

Frank Kuhnecke: Great.

00:43:25

James Redenbaugh: And once we have those questions, we can decide what. What tool is going to best for receiving those applications. We want to make a airtable form or a custom webflow form or something like that platform.

00:43:48

Andreas Fauler: Great.

00:43:50

James Redenbaugh: Cool. And then along those same lines, how should we be thinking about the enterprise journey for teams?

00:44:10

Andreas Fauler: Also problem statement. And I would say especially as we want to also have the chance to get signatures in Q4 and this is the last quarter of the year everybody looks at how can we impact the current closing of the Q4. So at the end we will somehow come up and say, hey, what we see is you're depending on a few big deals with your yearly performance as a sales leader. We want to help you make this safe and predictable and make secure these deals. So literally, this is literally the pain. And then.

00:44:53

Frank Kuhnecke: I think goal of the organizational page is to get in contact and we have to say what do we additional for the organization? We can do something additional, a learning program and how will it work for your employees? And I think that's enough. And he who is not interested won't contact us.

00:45:29

Andreas Fauler: And probably something like the graphic I just showed. So it'll say, hey, if you're using this kind of methodologies and not everybody is performing at super level, probably you will miss a piece. And this is sales Kung Fu. Yeah. And there it's. It's literally about having a conversation, understanding where they are and then we are. We have some modularity what we offer. What we think is if it's a large organization, we probably first work with a few people only probably the ones that are bearing the biggest opportunities. And then you have a high likelihood of a big positive impact. And then you grow into the other populations, something like this. So you would scope at the end what you do immediately and then have an outlook what can happen in addition.

00:46:21

Frank Kuhnecke: Oh, you see, we are not as concrete now with this part. So we have to make it concrete even in the mind mapping. And then we discussed it.

00:46:40

James Redenbaugh: That is fine. And I'm thinking aesthetically and drop some things in here. So the individual page, obviously largely about the individual journey. We want to the user see themselves as this practitioner and see a version of themselves that they can be, that they can step into and then also maybe down the page have some sense of the dojo that they could be in. Oh, I could join this group and practice these skills and be with others. You know, maybe I'm one of the only sales people in my company or maybe I'm the best one, but none of us are so great. So like, I don't feel like I.

00:47:59

Andreas Fauler: Can become the star performer. Yeah, exactly. That's ambitious goal. And then I want to be the. It's about the individual and how they vision, envision themselves somehow. Yeah, so envision their future self.

00:48:13

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, yeah. And with the enterprise groups, the user has their team, maybe their team is kind of ragtag and they want to get them into shape. And so I, I'm thinking graphics that are more high level, kind of top down. Less about the individual, more about strategy. I'm seeing kind of thesis coming into place or even imagery that conveys a territory is like, what is your strategy for Q4 look like, how can you bring us in as consultants for your army? You know, I don't want to, we don't need to use too much military metaphor. But like, what is, what are they, what ambitious things is their company moving towards that you can help them with as key partners? We want to make that clear.

00:49:26

Frank Kuhnecke: Yeah.

00:49:29

James Redenbaugh: And in enticing ways use some key graphics to see like, oh, okay, this could be, this could be really powerful.

00:49:44

Frank Kuhnecke: Okay.

00:49:46

James Redenbaugh: Cool. And then about slash who. I think that can be really easy when it comes together. You guys can write as much as you want about yourselves and your background. It can be formatted as, you know, one long text block or different aspects. Here's my philosophy, here's my background, here's how I'm doing X, Y and Z. So I could include some information in a Google Doc about how to think about that and how to start writing about that. And then yeah, I think we can bring it all together into a nice solid structure and start Designing things out.

00:50:49

Frank Kuhnecke: Right. Just for preventing, doing double work. When we make some graphics, the color red, white and black is already setting. We have the setting red, white and black.

00:51:12

James Redenbaugh: That's a good question.

00:51:14

Andreas Fauler: I think we have to find the color spectrum. I would say also, but I probably will comes up with some fancy stuff. But I would say the colors we all, until now used probably.

00:51:26

Will Dragon: Yeah, I mean, the red, white and black is something that we have used, you know, very simplistically at the moment. Again, I'm just looking at the kind of graphics that James is dropping in there. And you know, I, I love the fact, you know, you've got the kind of silhouetted character, so there's not too much, you know, we have to be careful as well about, you know, who are we talking to here? You know, we don't want to have like everyone that we feature is a man or, you know, a woman. You know, we need to be kind of fairly agnostic about how we talk about people and stuff like that. So again, just something to be mindful of. We don't want to kind of force our own, you know, kind of. What's the word I'm looking for? We don't want to kind of be. Yeah, sort of like funneling who we expect to be, like applying, you know, without, you know, being broad enough, you know, about who we're talking to. So, yeah, I think again, that's something that we can look at. Of course, we can always look at colors. You know, there's always a chance further down the line to have different colors for various different gates, etc. Etc. So again, that's something that we can expand out, you know, But I think at the moment, as long as we can get a core visual identity kind of like going that is going to be versatile enough for us to kind of build out on, then, you know, that's fine. And like you say, we've already got some graphics already that we've kind of been playing with. So again, I think, you know, we can expand out on that. And yeah, I mean, I think from this point of view, the, the kind of brand and the brand identity is something that is going to grow alongside, you know, the development of, of the core, the course and, you know, the. What we're delivering. So I think like I said, as long as it's robust enough to be able to be built upon, then it should be fine.

00:53:46

Frank Kuhnecke: Good.

00:53:49

Andreas Fauler: Right?

00:53:50

James Redenbaugh: Yeah, I'm a fan of having a simple primary color scheme and then Having secondary full spectrum colors that can be used in different key ways, like when we're talking about the stages of the journey or like you said, the different gates. But I think the red, white and black is a really powerful, simple aesthetic that can work well here. Yeah.

00:54:24

Frank Kuhnecke: And your red I like much more than our red.

00:54:30

James Redenbaugh: Great. Well, we'll can play with that and yeah. So next steps. You guys have some content homework this week? Will you now have access to the Figma so you can start dropping stuff in there? Yeah, if. And start playing around with Figma in General. Watch some YouTube videos if you want to hop on a call and ask questions about Figma from somebody who knows it pretty well but understands. I definitely have a lot more experience in Illustrator also, so I can talk to you about the differences and how we can use both.

00:55:14

Frank Kuhnecke: Cool.

00:55:17

James Redenbaugh: And yeah, I want to start doing some mood boarding as well so we can make an area for this to start bringing in some additional inspiration. And Frank andreas, if you guys have any other graphics or precedents of websites that you really like that you want to share or parts of sites or. Or design from other domains, also feel free to drop them in an email and send them over and I can pop them in here.

00:55:58

Frank Kuhnecke: Great.

00:56:00

Will Dragon: Cool. Yeah. So just from my point of view, by this time next week, hopefully should have some visuals based on the initial homepage design and just some top level stuff so that we can start to kind of look at, you know, and like James said, mood boards around, you know, just kind of collect. Collect. I think potentially mood boards is probably going to be the best way forward just to kind of sort of see where we want to be visually and then showing some of that maybe just light touches in context of what the actual website looks like. So. And then hopefully that should allow us to kind of make some informed decisions about where we want to take it.

00:56:38

James Redenbaugh: Okay, cool. Sounds good.

00:56:42

Will Dragon: Awesome.

00:56:44

James Redenbaugh: Well, thank you. Thank you guys for being here. Good to be in the conversation and we'll talk to you soon.

00:56:51

Will Dragon: Yeah, thanks. Have a good weekend.

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